daf bit: Kiddushin 29

[cellio]

Some commandments are binding on men but not on women, among them the following obligations to his son: to circumcise him, to redeem him, to teach him torah, to find him a wife, and to teach him a craft. Some say: and to teach him to swim. Rabbi Yehudah said that a man who does not teach his son a craft teaches him brigandry. (29a)

Comments

[xiphias.livejournal.com]

It's considered to be part making kids able to take care of themselves. If you live near a body of water, there's a chance your kids are going to fall in. You therefore are commanded to make them death-resistant, by teaching them to swim.

This concept has been expanded to include other skill sets. Martial arts, for instance: if you live in an area where your kids might get beat up, the argument goes, you have a responsibility to teach them self-defense. It's not universally accepted, of course.

Me, I'd consider this a requirement to teach your kids basic self-defense, gun safety, basic wilderness survival, swimming, and first aid.

[caryabend.livejournal.com]

It's considered to be part making kids able to take care of themselves. If you live near a body of water, there's a chance your kids are going to fall in. You therefore are commanded to make them death-resistant, by teaching them to swim.

My snarky side responds: So if you live near a cliff, you teach them to fly? :)

On the serious side, even though bodies of water are dangerous, they are also pleasurable, and a fantastic natural resource. Without the ability to swim, one loses a substantial amount of the utility of the water.

[xiphias.livejournal.com]

No, but you ARE required to build a fence around it, if it's a danger.

[caryabend.livejournal.com]

That would make sense, but there must be practicality limits. A fence around the entire Grand Canyon?

Of course, now I'm mixing and comparing the metaphors of building fences around the torah and a cliff, set to the proverb, "Good fences make good neighbors."

Clearly, I need more sleep.

[xiphias.livejournal.com]

If it's on your property, you are required to take reasonable efforts to make sure that it's not a danger to passerby. If it's entirely within your property, your responsibilities are lessened, but not eliminated.

If you lived next to the Grand Canyon, your responsibility would be to put a fence around your property, or, at least, the generally travelled part of your property, such that people on your property would not wander off a cliff in the middle of the night.

[cellio]

On the serious side, even though bodies of water are dangerous, they are also pleasurable, and a fantastic natural resource. Without the ability to swim, one loses a substantial amount of the utility of the water.

That's an important point. The safest reaction to something potentially dangerous is to stay away, but that's not what the rabbis call for. Balance is important, and pleasure is worth a small risk.

[cellio]

Me, I'd consider this a requirement to teach your kids basic self-defense, gun safety, basic wilderness survival, swimming, and first aid.

That's about how I interpret it too.

Thanks for all the interesting discussion. I was a bit surprised when I saw the volume of comments; my daf bits usually don't attract that much attention. :-)

[xiphias.livejournal.com]

I read them all, though, even if I never comment.