daf bit: Avodah Zarah 38

[cellio]

Last week we talked about restrictions on wine when heathens are involved. This week the talmud discusses (over several pages) other articles that, if they come from heathens, are prohibited to Jews but we can benefit from them in other ways (like selling them). They include:

• Milk which a heathen milked without an Israelite being present, because we are concerned that milk from non-kosher animals could be mixed in.

• Their bread and oil (but Rabbi permitted oil). This appears to be to impede intermingling that could lead to intermarriages. (Remember that bread is a staple of meals.)

• Stewed and preserved foods that are customarily made with wine (presumably because you can't really tell).

• Pickled minced herring, because you can't clearly identify the fish as a kosher species when it's minced.

However, a Jew may consume milk milked by a heathen if an Israelite supervised, pickled herring that wasn't minced (so you can identify the fish), and even preserved foods that they don't customarily make with wine. (35b-39b)

With the exception of the bread and oil, these restrictions are all about uncertainty about ingredients. Non-Jews wouldn't have any reason to care about the restrictions of Jewish law, after all.

Comments

[cellio]

I meant in the sense of "not relevant", not in the sense of "that's your problem not mine". For example, I never cared about whether sauces I bought to cook with contained MSG, until I had a friend with a strong MSG allergy so now it mattered and I started checking if we were eating together. I don't think the talmud is talking about non-Jews who have Jewish friends and yet don't worry about what's in the food; I think it's more like how if I go into a non-Jewish bakery it's a good bet that the pie crusts are made with lard (which I'm told is superior to other fats in that context).

In modern times we've all gotten more aware of diverse dietary needs; we probably have vegetarians to thank for pie crusts without lard starting to be available, same as we now instinctively pay attention to peanuts, transfats, and the like. I doubt this sort of concern was as prominent then.

[siderea]

I doubt this sort of concern was as prominent then.

It's not just about personal affection. One of the points I think we can take from the historical record of kosher garum is that there have always been goyisher merchants who wanted to sell things to Jews. Presumably extra-specially true in areas of high Jewish population.

My cold medication has a hechsher on it. And it doesn't even have alcohol in it. But along with being advertised as gluten free and non-drowsy making, it's safe for Orthodox Jews, at least not during Passover (has corn syrup in).

Jewish money: the same color as everybody else's money.

[minoanmiss]

This is very true, and anyway, who am I to challenge the sages? smiles wryly At any rate I will do my best to be inspired to mindffulness now.